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Joe Boster
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Posted: 12 July 2011 at 9:34am | IP Logged | 1  

Max Eisenhardt is his new good guy name. Brand new in X-Men: Schism. Eric did lots of bad things so he wants to be called Max now.  They also ripped Joe Kubert's Yossel story and gave it to Magneto. I threw up in my mouth a little when I read that.
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Michael Todd
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Posted: 12 July 2011 at 10:42am | IP Logged | 2  


 QUOTE:
Xavier was in his 20s when we were introduced to him in X-MEN 1. Yet, a few years later, he was revealed to have served, as an adult, in the Korean War.

That still could have worked, if Xavier had been drafted at 18 or 19 to serve in the last year of the war he would still have only been 28 or 29 ten years later in 1963.

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Brian Joseph Mayer
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Posted: 12 July 2011 at 12:46pm | IP Logged | 3  

I always say Xavier as much, much older when I was a kid. I never thought he was in his 20s. I think that may largely have been due to my stereotype of wheelchairs and the disabled. I just associated them with someone much older.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 12 July 2011 at 12:50pm | IP Logged | 4  

Eric did lots of bad things so he wants to be called Max now.

••

Why do serial killers never think of this when they get caught?

"John Wayne Gacey? No, I want to be called Roy Schneider from now on! There, all better!"

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Eric Smearman
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Posted: 12 July 2011 at 3:22pm | IP Logged | 5  

I always saw Professor Xavier and Reed Richards as being roughly
the same age and thought both were in their early forties.
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Michael Todd
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Posted: 12 July 2011 at 3:24pm | IP Logged | 6  


 QUOTE:
I never thought he was in his 20s. I think that may largely have been due to my stereotype of wheelchairs and the disabled. I just associated them with someone much older.

Also being bald and a Professor lends to the impression of him being over 40.

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Aaron Smith
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Posted: 12 July 2011 at 11:31pm | IP Logged | 7  

Max Eisenhardt is his new good guy name. Brand new in X-Men: Schism. Eric did lots of bad things so he wants to be called Max now. 

***

That is one of the stupidest things I've ever heard. Whatever happened to the real Marvel?

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Michael Todd
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Posted: 13 July 2011 at 12:42am | IP Logged | 8  

It was hijacked by a wild pack of fanboys Aaron. "Mister we could use some men like Stan and Jack once again".

Edited by Michael Todd on 13 July 2011 at 12:42am
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Michael Todd
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Posted: 13 July 2011 at 3:44am | IP Logged | 9  

Take a gander at this letter from the Incredible Hulk #6, (March 1963) note how Stan dismisses the crazy suggestions of this reader, sadly today it would probably be considered.

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Carmen Bernardo
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Posted: 13 July 2011 at 5:38am | IP Logged | 10  

That Greg Smith character might well be one of the editors at Marvel Comics today!
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Petter Myhr Ness
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Posted: 13 July 2011 at 11:47am | IP Logged | 11  

I never thought of Magneto having an accent at all. But then, when I first read a story with him, he didn't have a known real name.

As for his yet another name (Max): Exhibit Z as for why I don't read X-men anymore.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 13 July 2011 at 12:05pm | IP Logged | 12  

I never thought of Magneto having an accent at all. But then, when I first read a story with him, he didn't have a known real name.

••

Which is how it should have stayed.

One of the things I came to appreciate, as a reader, was how DIFFERENT Magneto was from Doom.

Doom's history we knew in quite intimate detail. We'd "met" his father. We knew about his mother. We'd seen his first love (slipped magically into scenes where she had not been before, rather like the Jack Black character on that episode of COMMUNITY). We understood him to have his own kind of tortured nobility, his own set of rules, which might be messed up, but to which he could be depended upon to adhere. Doom, in a really twisted way, was someone we could trust.

Magneto, on the other hand, was a cipher. We knew nothing of his background, his upbringing, his ethnic heritage. We knew nothing of his family, mother, father, wife, children. And there was no question of him being "noble" in any way. He was the complete opposite of Charles Xavier, even more than Doom was the opposite of Reed Richards. He was, in a nutshell, a complete and unabashed son of a bitch.

And I really liked that! I liked very much that Marvel villains were not the cardboard cutouts I had grown used to at DC. They had depth, they had motives (beyond Kill The Hero. But Magneto -- there was no shading to him. He wanted to enslave humankind -- and there was always that sense that having done so, he would set about enslaving the rest of homo superior, too!

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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 13 July 2011 at 1:53pm | IP Logged | 13  

Having recently read the entire original X-Men run, I totally agree.

Magneto was truly evil from the start--not a freedom fighter by any stretch. His goal was to RULE. He treated his "allies" as mere tools. He sought to impose his will upon humans and mutants alike.

Magneto was the quintessential X-Men foe because his goals were the polar opposite of theirs. We didn't need to know anything more about him than that. He was the sort of mutant the X-Men were created to stop. That's all that mattered.

While Doom and other Marvel villains were fleshed out in some detail, Magneto represented those villains who come out of nowhere and are just plain evil. The how and why is not important.

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Matt Hawes
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Posted: 13 July 2011 at 2:54pm | IP Logged | 14  



This panel always comes to mind when I think about how the character of Magneto has been changed over the years. Mastermind, working for Magneto, creates the above army of neo-Nazi-like troops. An odd choice, considering the history that was later given to Magneto.
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Kip Lewis
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Posted: 13 July 2011 at 3:48pm | IP Logged | 15  

I do have to admit, I never saw Doom as noble before JB's run. Of
course, with Doom, my first impressions came from the Hanna Barbara
FF cartoon and Marv Wolfman's FF, where his people feared and hated
him, and few other titles in mid-70s. Then again, at the age of 10,
villains aren't noble, so that wouldn't register even if it was there.
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Michael Todd
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Posted: 13 July 2011 at 4:03pm | IP Logged | 16  

Well let's face it, Stan Lee and Jack Kirby didn't intend for Magneto to have been a concentration camp survivor.
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Matt Hawes
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Posted: 13 July 2011 at 5:38pm | IP Logged | 17  

Michael, exactly.

A lot of people want to draw a connection between Professor Xavier and Magneto, and Malcolm X and Martin Luther King, Jr. That is, fighting for equality, one through peace, the other through more militant means.

But, honestly, I think Stan Lee and Jack Kirby thought of Magneto more like a Hitler, exterminating or enslaving those he perceived as being lessor beings than himself. Magneto was not a character striving for peace at any cost in those original issues, he was a tyrant who wanted to rule or crush the human race. Kirby's use of Nazi imagery in the panel I posted above seems to be in line with that conclusion.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 13 July 2011 at 6:24pm | IP Logged | 18  

Mastermind, working for Magneto, creates the above army of neo-Nazi-like troops. An odd choice, considering the history that was later given to Magneto.

••

Astonishing the number of people I have seen invoke abused child syndrome to explain this -- the abused child grows up to become himself abusive. Sure, it happens. But move that into the environment of a comic book -- especially as the backstory on a mass-murdering supervillain -- and it becomes the worst kind of insulting psychobabble.

Lee and Kirby -- both Jewish -- knew exactly what they wanted to say with that neo-Nazi imagery. In was instant and unmistakable shorthand for "This guy is the worst kind of bad."

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Paulo Pereira
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Posted: 13 July 2011 at 7:37pm | IP Logged | 19  

The Magneto backstory feels tacked on to me. The guy was a right bastard for 20 years worth of comics. One day some dubious origin is inserted and he suddenly becomes sympathetic? Blah.
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Michael Todd
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Posted: 13 July 2011 at 7:37pm | IP Logged | 20  

It's this crazy age that we live in, ever since the late 70's it's been frowned on to say that anyone is just a bad guy, no now you're supposed to try to look deeper to find what motivates "this poor soul' to do such terrible things and then help them to overcome it through sympathy and understanding. Thanks but no thanks. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar and a Super-Villain should just be a Super-Villain. I want my comic books to be clear cut simple fun sometimes, so that I can escape into a world where heroes fight villains and not a complex reflection of the nutty world in which we actually live.
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Paul Kimball
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Posted: 13 July 2011 at 9:58pm | IP Logged | 21  

I do have to admit, I never saw Doom as noble before JB's run.
++++++++
I never have, just can't see a murdering despot as noble. Maybe noble
intentions somewhere deep down.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 14 July 2011 at 3:48am | IP Logged | 22  

The key phrase is "…his own kind of tortured nobility…".
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Michael Todd
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Posted: 14 July 2011 at 5:08am | IP Logged | 23  

Count Dracula was always portrayed as being noble in his own way as well, and he's murdered a lot more folks than Doctor Doom ever did.

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Paulo Pereira
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Posted: 14 July 2011 at 6:15am | IP Logged | 24  

Not always. The original book didn't portray him as such.
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Kip Lewis
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Posted: 14 July 2011 at 6:48am | IP Logged | 25  

"His own kind of tortured nobility"; I guess I didn't see that originally.
I saw him as someone who was completely Macchavellian, which to
me, excludes nobility, except when it helps. Before it seemed like he
just wanted to rule the world for pride, nowadays, he wants to rule for
pride and because he believes he can make the world better..

Plus, it isn't just himself, it's his people. Wolfman wrote his people as
hating him and he looked at them as mere pawns of his will, but over
last 20 years, we see he cares about his people, provides for them and
they love/respect him. I don't know if Wolfman's views matched what
Stan Lee wrote, but that's why I said, I never considered Doom noble
(by any view) before JB. (But I like this view better.)

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